Celica Forums General Discussion General cold start rattle

Hello!

I've had my celica (2003 gts) for a couple of months, mostly I've been perfectly happy with her.

Since a couple weeks ago, when I turn on the car in the morning, the engine has a rattle, for half a second or so. After that it works perfectly normal.

I tried to make a video of it, but the microphone can't pick up the rattle, I can only hear it from inside the car.
(link to video: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1lBukScUo4PWTWpV_F9PtbyJFcCo2VK0J/view?usp=sharing)

I guess the oil drips down to the bottom, but I want to know if this is fixable, and if I should be concerned about it.

I changed the oil in july, used 5w-40 oil instead of the specified 5w-30, because the last winters were way colder than -20C.

Thanks in advance.

Hello,

Sorry I am late replying, I had a few questions;

Is your Celica a manual or automatic?

and is there another way to share the video?
I am having getting an error when I click on the link.

I have an automatic vehicle that on start up has a metalic rattle that i think is the flex plate and/or torque converter causing the rattle,
so maybe it could be that.

I will try to access the video on my personal computer in a few hours,

I can't see the link currently, so I apologize I can't assist you any further, however I did pull up a few websites on the how the oil works,
and I believe you put a higher viscosity oil in your engine which may not help with with what you are trying to do.

"In a 5W-30 for example, the number before the W describes the viscosity of the oil at low temperatures. The lower the number, the thinner the oil and the better the oil’s cold temperature/ cold start performance. The number after the W describes how thick the oil is at the engine’s normal operating temperature."
Source: https://www.rymax-lubricants.com/blog/what-does-5w-30-actually-mean/

"The first number represents the temperature index of the oil i.e. the coldest temperature at which it can pass or start flowing. It shows the viscosity rating of the oil. This means, 10W-40 oil can flow at 10 degrees Celsius. Similarly, the 5W-40 oil can flow at 5 degrees Celsius.

The second number represents its viscosity at 100 degC i.e. 40. The second number actually shows the viscosity (thinness/thickness) of the motor oil. Viscosity grades for engine oil range from 20, 30, 40, 50, to 60.

Here, higher the number thicker is the oil. This simply means the 10W-40 oil is thicker than 10W-30 oil. Similarly, a 5W-50 is thicker than 10W-40 engine oil. However, it can flow at a much lower temperature of 5 deg Celsius."

Source: https://carbiketech.com/engine-oil-nomenclature-naming/


I am going to see if I can access the link on my personal computer and I will get back to you.

Sorry, for not being much help at this time.

Thank you for replying!

Since then it's gotten even colder, and I managed to record a second video, the noise can be heard more clearly, and for a longer duration.
I uploaded this one on YouTube, I hope you can watch it now:
https://youtu.be/pVuwnT6LdpM

So I guess I should be changing oil then. I don't know how much damage this could have caused though. I specifically read that 5w-40 would be better in the cold, and I've read many people use 5w-40 in their Celica. I really hope this didn't do much damage, because I want to keep driving this car for a long time.

Hello,

it shouldn't do much damage if any at all, I used to use heavier oil in the summer for my other vehicle that would carry over in to the winter and she still runs good. Normally I see people use a heavier weight in the summer to prevent the heat from breaking down the oil. Also a heavier weight is used if the engine burns a lot of oil, using a thick oil can slow the oil consumption down.

Also,
Is your Celica a manual shift transmission or an automatic transmission?

it's a manual.

Thanks for helping out, it really got me worried!

But if it's really not causing any damage, wouldn't it be better if I keep using it in the winter?

Also, it doesn't burn any oil at all, but cooling liquid is disappearing, and I have to refill it bimonthly or so.

The coolant issue is very concerning, that is pretty frequently refilling it.
Have you seen any leaks under the car?
If you still have splash shields under neath the engine you may not see it underneath.
Whenever coolant is disappearing I always hope for a leak in the hoses. Easier to replace
and means its not the head gasket (most of the time, it could also be a head gasket leak in certain situations)

The next time you start in the morning or after a few hours, if you have another person can you
have the other person start it while you have your hands on the left side and the right side of the valve cover to determine which side the sound is coming from?

It was coming from the left.

About the coolant, I refill it from low to in the middle between low and full.

There is this cap:


Which is sometimes wet at the tip, I think it evaporates from there.

Shouldn't the oil have a milky color if it's the head gasket?

It was coming from the left.

About the coolant, I refill it from low to in the middle between low and full.

There is this cap:
https://goo.gl/images/VSVp5z

Which is sometimes wet at the tip, I think it evaporates from there.

Shouldn't the oil have a milky color if it's the head gasket?

Not always will you get milky oil from a blown head gasket, engines could get a small leak in to the combustion chamber, or even possibly but least likely a blown head gasket it that leaks directly down the side of the block and not into the oil or combustion chamber.

Perhaps i misread, I appologize. DO you fill it up twice a month or every two months? Every two months is a a lot better and as long as you keep it up you should be fine, and just keep an eye for leaks when and if they occur.

If you are getting a rattle from the left side, I am assuming from when you are holding it and your left side while looking at the engine.
That could possibly be a timing chain tensioner issue where it could possibly loses a small amount of pressure against the chain over night and cause the rattle as you start the engine before the chain gets to a point where it likes.

or there are a lot of oil passages, especially for the VVTL-I system and perhaps there is the noise due to oil not getting to top end components.

Do you know the service history for your car if it has had a timing chain, guides, and tensioner done?
Its not definitive that it is a timing chain or oil getting to the top issues. I have read that the oil pumps for our engines
tend to wear out after a period of time and it could be that it takes longer to pump the oil to the top.

and another idea, maybe its the intake cam gear lock pin.

If you remove the fuel pump fuse, and try to start it, does the sound still go away after a few seconds?

I refill it every 2-3 months. And now that I think about it, only after longer trips. I still think that it evaporates from that black tube.

Today when starting the car in the morning, it didn't have that sound. I left the key on ignition for longer, before starting the engine. (Also to note, when my my girlfriend started the car, the sound was present for a lot longer, and she didn't wait for ignition at all)

The timing chain certainly could be the culprit, since it was last serviced at 100k kms, and now the odometer's at 180k.

Thanks for helping out so much so far!

sorry I have been off for a bit trying to buy a house and move.

Are you able to attain lift?

I have been looking at a lot of forums and it seems like after a certain mileage/kilometers
they get a rattle of start up. To clarify if it din't rattle before then there is something that needs to be looks at and possibly replaced and not all of the rattles everyone else is having is similar to yours.

Most of the other forums pointed to

Timing Chain related, intake cam gear lock pin related or unknown/not posted.

There was on forum where the gentleman had a broken or loose bolt sitting on the engine in just away that it would slighty rattle when starting and then go away either by engine noise drowning it out or just that the engine its does generate that much vibration as an electrical motor forcing the engine to turn over.