Celica Forums General Discussion Exterior HOTSHOT INSTALLED TODAY!

Alright guys, I installed the header today. I know that you have been waiting for this, so here it is.

The install, wasn't the easiest thing, but was not as difficult as I thought. I have heard that is a huge pain in the ass. It takes time and pstience, but is fairly simple. Everyone goes through the bottom, so I decided to go for the top.
-The first thing I did was take off the valve cover, and unbolted the heat shield bolts that I could from the top.
-Then I jacked up the car and disconnected the exhaust (it would be much easier to take out the whole mid pipe, I had to leave mine in...long story).
-Then starting taking out the other heatshield bolts. The bottom heat shield (in between header and motor) was a pain for me to get out cause of my midpipe being in the way.
-5 nuts on studs holding header to the engine, and then towards the bottom of the header, it is connected to a bracket.
-once disconnected I wiggled the header out the top. I didn't have to mess with any suspension and pry the engine to make room. The hotshot header went right in through the top as well.
Putting it together is quicker than taking it off because the heat shields do not go back on.

Gains - haven't tested it yet, but it made my car deeper and louder. I am letting it break in for a few days and letting the ECU get acquainted.

If you have any other questions, feel free to ask.

Dan

TEST TEST TEST... I WANNA KNOW WHAT YOU THINK!!! I heard the stupid pulleys might cause a battery drain (something I heard from a guy on this board who has them)so I asked around, havn't heard anything back about it... so I am debating the whole header/pulley thing.

Are you powering a lot with your car, such as ,music system, alarm, windows, sunroof, neons, etc.? That will mater, but it also depends on the battery you have. There are 2 different batteries for us, Ones bigger ans ones smaller, so it depends on your battery.
Battery drain = draining the battery, this pulley will not drain the battery, it just will not have the Alt. work to its max performance, but I do not think there is anything to worry about.

sweetness...post some results dude! and what did the pulley have to do with the headers? or did i read that post wrong?

Me and FX MAN have been talking about low end gains. It has been said that the header takes away form the low end, but the pulley helps in the low end, so it all works toigether.

pulleys are nice.. removing the reasonator and having straight pipie put in is better and cheaper ($55)

SHI_GTS, I've already got that, with a high flow cat.

Spider- just a little help, you dont have to let everything break in. The onlything that breaks in would maybe be the gaskets(this spells like shit)but your ECU doesnt need to break in.

Yea, I got that gasket smell, but it went away quickly. I am still breaking in my motor, I just got the block and head replaced.

did you blow your motor or something

You got it.

The header is just time consuming. Not hard very self explanatory. I do not recommend going through the bottom. I liked doing it through the top, although I spent sometime underneath, but no messing with the suspension like others have done. Like I said, you need patience. The thing with the cat, check out a muffler shop nearby. I just went to one here and they hooked me up.

They probably won't care. I don't know how your shops work. What parts though, just the cat? Make sure you get the right size and whatnot.

Are you just getting a cat, or custom piping from cat to the muffler. I got 2.5.

I got TSRM. It is basically just a muffler. Bolts on under the rear of the car after the resonator. I eliminated the resonator with custom piping and high flow cat. I am debating on getting the TRD though.

[ 04-13-2003, 12:00 AM: Message edited by: SpiderManGT ]

guys before you go do all this custom piping please make sure you dont take it to a random muffler shop. i new a guy that went to a shop to get this done and his car sounded like shit after it was completed. not only that but it backfires all the time. go to a professional speed shop and get it done. those muff guys just mess things up

spider- get the TRD and sell the TSRM. those mufflers sound like shit compared to what is out there. TRD may be more $$$ but spend the extra to get the best!

I can vouch for that Taylor. I found that out the hard way. Where is a good shop in the houston area?

let me talk to some guys around here. houston imports are realy cool. they hooked me up for free but they really dont do exhuast work. ill ask. if i were you i would go back to the place you went to and ask them to put the stock shit back on and work on getting a diff muffler.

I doubt they still have my stock stuff still. What do you mean a different muffler? Whats wrong with what I got, what do you recommend? I just feel like starting from scratch all over again.

i love my TRD. Greddy is good also. the problem with yours is i think it is considered one of the loudest ones on the market. Thermal R&D does a great job with theres as well. Dont get frustrated. dont start over. try to advertise your muffler to sell it. then buy the other muffler. TRD or Greddy. its not up to me. I run TRD because it was free. I love it. sound is deep and not to loud.

TRD Cat Back ALL THE WAY.. hands down the best exhaust for our cars (Dyno proven also). There was a comparison in Turbo magazine of all exhausts for the celica, TRD was ahead in torque and whp gains, all the others were not even worth it really. Club Celica had the article online but the link is broken right now.

Back to the thread.. Have you driven the car yet?????

good job Spidey! , post some pics and a video of it!

hey spidy !!

im glad you got it in, let me know how it goes, IM me.

and the alternator pulleys, they dont drain the battery but it just doesnt produce that my electrical current through your car..

Dea7, you got a PM.

hey dea7hr0w, how are your hotshot headers?

Ok, it is really starting to get under my skin. The celica has only one header. It is driving me crazy that every says "headers". Sorry, just venting a little, and no offense to anyone.

actually OBX makes a 4-2-1 header boasting 12whp gains in the GT(which I have heard a few people call bullshit on), it's supposed to be a bitch to install because it doesn't quite fit. I heard Trial was working on a GT header due to the success of their GTS header.. but who knows..

sorry dude but i have to correct you on that, the TSRM is way ahead of TRD exhaust, correct me again if im wrong but thats what a read on the Turbo mag issue, thats what made me want to plan and buy the TSRM than the TRD but i never bought it though, got me a custom and im happy with it...

on my way out, PEACE!

i like my header, they are very sexy and spidey explained it all from the sound to the performance

Alright guys, I've been noticing some impressive gains lately. I've been getting on it a little more now that my motor is broken in a bit. I don't notice that low end loss, but I do notice gains in the high end. Especially when I hit 4000 RPMs. I don't know about the whole lift feeling, but it feels good. I don't know what lift feels like, but it doesn't feel like there is this sudden boost. I like the header and have no regrets.

good to know i would so buy it if i wasn't waiting for teh damn turbo kits to come out

I will turbo my car...eventually, but I need something to hold me over until then.

ok this is a retarded question, but if you turbo the gt, you need to replace the header? and the hotshot wouldnt work properly? (hey spidey, i left it singular, just for you )...didnt realize the whole "header" "headers" thing...

[ 04-14-2003, 11:34 PM: Message edited by: vejita_13 ]

Vejita, thanks for correcting the grammar. It was just beginning to really bother me.

About the turbo, yes you will need a new exhaust manifold/header. I think they usually come with the kit if it doesn't then you need to buy one. Correct if I'm wrong though guys.

yes, you will need to get one that fits the turbo because i think the turbine goes right after the 4 exhaust runners, and before the downpipe. i think

A turbocharger replaces a header. A turbocharger connects to the exhaust manifold bolted to the head, connected to the turbocharger, then to the downpipe.. On a turbo'd car their is no such thing as "headers." Headers are for N/A cars or supercharged cars(superchargers do not run off of exhaust gas like turbos do). Hope this helps!

Scott
1995 Eagle Talon TSI AWD (blue)
1995 Eagle Talon TSI AWD (red)
2000 Toyota Celica GTS (red)

doh... if you don't have an exhaust manifold how do you pipe the gasses out of the engine??? I have never heard anyting like this one before.. I know you need a new header for turbo because you have to have room for the fan that powers the turbo.. as far as not needing an exhaust manifold... um.. that's a little odd.. a header and a turbo/supercharger replace your intake.. you still have to get the gasses to the cat when they leave the engine..

[ 04-15-2003, 10:54 PM: Message edited by: FX-MAN ]

Why would a new head be needed for a turbo to be added?

does it matter?? No one makes a turbo for the celica GT.. and a custom turbo will cost as much as the car.. if you have that kind of money just sell it and buy a car with a better engine or wait for the TRD supercharger to fit in our engine bay. Pretty simple.. I keep hearing people talk about Turbo.. I have never seen anyone who actually has a turbo celica who isn't a SHOP that can afford 20K to just to make a celica GT have the power of an Eclipse GT or an RSXtypeS stock, I guess I just don't see the point of spending THAT much money to do it.. TRD Supercharger.. I would buy in a heartbeat. but a $8-$20K turbo.. no way.

[ 04-15-2003, 11:04 PM: Message edited by: FX-MAN ]

I think David Draper's Turbo kit is done, but the only way to get it done is to go to West Covina. Is that right? Plus there are several kits coming out soon, and by the time I get the money for the turbo, there will be kits to chose from.

a header isn't for intake, it's for exhaust.

a turbocharger specifically gets its power from the exhaust gases exiting the cylinders. the exhaust which comes out of the pipes from the cylinders spins a turbine that shares a commmon axle with a compressor, which forces air back into the engine. so basically with a turbo, you get a special exhaust manifold where four pipes go into a turbine. the turbo assembly then connects to the downpipe. so you would have to replace the stock exhaust manifold or your aftermarket header anyway.


from howstuffworks.com

[ 04-15-2003, 11:32 PM: Message edited by: glitch ]

as for turbo kits... this looks like the most promising one

stafford fabrications turbo kit [newcelica.org]

yeah... why did you quote me... that's what I SAID... a turbo/supercharger is for INTAKE, but you need a new head to make room for the fan that spins the turbo...right... ??? I am lost as to why you dropped my whole post in there then restated what I said..

[ 04-15-2003, 11:40 PM: Message edited by: FX-MAN ]

sorry... was just trying to help because this is what you said:

didn't make sense because a header is for exhaust, not intake.

you're right I just read my thread, it didn't make sense... what I meant was that it replaced your intake NOT your header.. but you will probably need a new header with a turbo, but could probably keep your header with a supercharger since it doesn't use exhaust to power it. I think I started the sentence with something to say about the header taking gasses to the cat then broke into another sentence... hehe.. I musta been a bit rattled.

, supercharger involves only the intake manifold and turbo involves the intake manifold plus the exhaust manifold...

TurboCharger




The Basics...

Air entering the engine first passes through an exhaust driven compressor. Compressed air results in a larger quantity of air being forced into the engine, creating more power.

The energy used to drive the turbo compressor is extracted from waste exhaust gasses. As exhaust gasses leave the engine they are directed through a wheel placed in the exhaust flow. The gasses drive the turbine wheel around, which is directly connected via a shaft, to the compressor wheel.

Increased exhaust gas drives the turbine wheel faster, this provides the engine more air, producing more power. A limit is met once a pre-determined boost pressure is achieved. At this point the exhaust gas is redirected away from the turbine wheel, thus slowing it down and limiting the maximum boost pressure. This redirection valve is known as the wastegate.

This extraction of energy, from exhaust gas, to improve engine efficiency is the device known as the turbocharger.

Turbochargers are usually seen as power enhancements on performance cars, but today, turbochargers are becoming more regularly used to provide greater torque on small capacity engines. The advantages of using a turbo engine include improved fuel efficiency and reduced exhaust emissions.

The main components of a turbocharger are:

Compressor housing and wheel

Bearing Housing
Turbine wheel
Journal bearings
Thrust bearings
Turbine housing
Wastegate
Actuator

SuperCharger



How does an Eaton supercharger work? A supercharger is a positive displacement pump. Its purpose is to increase air pressure and density in the intake manifold. It does this by pumping more air than the engine would use without a supercharger. The supercharger is matched to the engine by its displacement and belt ratio, and can provide excess airflow at any engine speed. This concentrated charge of air provided by the supercharger results in a more powerful combustion stroke in the engine's cylinders, resulting in improved performance over non-supercharged vehicles.

How did Eaton become involved in supercharging? In 1949, Eaton toyed with a helical rotor supercharger and even built a 75-cubic inch displacement prototype. This supercharger was "temporarily" set aside since improved performance was achieved through larger displacement engines. The late 70's spurred new interest in supercharging, since gasoline prices were driven up due to the energy crisis. Eaton continued to improve its design and addressed issues such as noise and durability. It was through these many design improvements, and an eye toward manufacturing, that allowed Eaton to begin working with Ford Motor Company on the 3.8L engine in 1984. Vehicle demonstrations, durability and noise concerns were refined, as well as a cost effective manufacturing process, which allowed the Eaton supercharger to be installed on the first production supercharged vehicle since 1957. The 1989 Ford Thunderbird SC was awarded the Motor Trend Car of the Year award. In addition, three engineers were also recognized for their work on the supercharger having been awarded the Society of Automotive Engineer's first Henry Ford II Award for Engineering Excellence.

The roots supercharger has been around for a long time, how is the Eaton supercharger different? The Eaton supercharger is essentially a Roots blower pump, with one substantial design wrinkle; each rotor has been twisted 60 degrees to form a helix. The two counter rotating rotors have three lobes, which intermesh during operation. These twisted rotors, along with specially designed inlet and outlet port geometry, help to reduce pressure variations resulting in a smooth discharge of air and a low level of noise during operation. This arrangement also improves efficiency over traditional Roots superchargers. With helical rotors and an axial inlet the Eaton supercharger can be spun to up to 14,000 rpm, thereby reducing package size.

How is an Eaton supercharger different from a turbocharger? A supercharger is connected directly to the crankshaft by a belt unlike a turbocharger which is driven by exhaust gases. An Eaton supercharger provides improved horsepower and torque, at lower engine rpm's, by pumping extra air into the engine in direct relationship to crankshaft speed. The positive connection yields instant response, in contrast to turbochargers, which must overcome inertia and spin up to speed as the flow of exhaust gas increases. The supercharger is a way to get around "turbo lag". The lubrication system also differs, in that, the supercharger is self-contained whereas the turbocharger requires engine oil.

How long has Eaton been manufacturing superchargers? Production for Ford Motor Company began in 1989, and was soon followed in 1992 by General Motors first supercharged vehicles.

What are the benefits of the Eaton supercharger? 1) Patented technology to reduce noise, 2) Proven manufacturing capability, 3) Packaging flexibility, i.e. reduced package size, 4) Self-contained lubrication, i.e. no external oil connections to the engine, 5) Bypass system used for unloading supercharger during idle and light load, resulting in better fuel economy and quiet operation, 6) Competitive pricing.

Are Eaton superchargers noisy? The Eaton supercharger system incorporates a specially designed bypass valve, which is actuated by a vacuum motor near the throttle body, and recirculates the supercharger air flow when boost is not required. During typical driving conditions, the engine is under boost around 5% of the time, which means the remaining 95% of the time the engine is under vacuum, allowing for better fuel economy and a quieter ride. In addition, the helix angled rotors, along with specially designed inlet and outlet port geometry, also reduce pressure variations resulting in a smooth discharge flow and a lower level of noise during operation. The associated ducting and mounting used in installing the supercharger can play a major role in reducing the noise emitted by the supercharger.

Is an Eaton supercharger reliable? The reliability of the Eaton supercharger was the first criteria, which was addressed during early design development of the supercharger. Dedicated engineers with backgrounds in compressors, gearing, tribology and metallurgy, as well as thermal and structural analysis enabled Eaton to find solutions to many reliability concerns. In addition, strict customer durability test criteria have been achieved. Successful completion of numerous 500 hour durability tests established a firm grasp on achieving a reliable product. In addition, numerous vehicles have successfully completed 100,000 mile, OEM (original equipment manufacturer), vehicle durability tests. Improvements in bearing and seal designs also aided in a product which meets all OEM durability criteria.

Is the performance benefit offset by the cost associated with an Eaton supercharger? In comparing a supercharged 3.8 liter, 2-valve/cylinder V6 engine with a non-supercharged 4.0 liter, 4-valve/cylinder V8, the supercharged vehicle will provide better power [torque], and at a lower overall cost, than the non-supercharged vehicle. This is due to complexity and tooling associated with the more complex 4-valve/cylinder engine.

What about fuel economy and flexible fuels? Supercharging is compatible with all types of fuels including flexible fuels, i.e. CNG (compressed natural gas), propane, etc. Fuel economy is not compromised, as described above in item #7, when utilizing the bypass system in conjunction with the supercharger. EPA (environmental protection agency) figures support this claim. A typical domestic vehicle equipped with an Eaton supercharger shows no fuel economy penalty for highway driving, and only a one mile per gallon penalty for city driving.

How does Eaton view supercharging for the future? With the continued interest in performance, and the desire to maintain fuel economy, supercharging could be the ideal product of the future. Using an Eaton supercharger to increase power on a smaller displacement engine, in turn achieving the performance of a larger engine, but not compromising fuel economy seems too good to be true--but that is what an Eaton supercharger provides. Current annual OEM usage is at 300,000 superchargers.

Is the supercharger available for aftermarket applications? The majority of Eaton supercharger applications have been designed for specific OEM applications. This is due to the fact that each engine application has unique hardware installation requirements and the design criteria of the supercharger is matched to the specific engine. Recent interest has, however, been shown in this market and has resulted in aftermarket applications being sourced through Magnuson Products. Current applications include: Miata 1.6 and 1.8L, Honda 1.6L, and a 5.0L Mustang kit available through BBK Performance.

as for the aguement:
if you installed new headers like hotshot you have to get rid of it when your goin to get the turbo kit coz the Turbine Housing needs to set on your exhaust manifold specially built for your turbo...

by the way, its not header, its headers

[ 04-17-2003, 04:36 PM: Message edited by: Street Prototype ]

i thought headers was plural for header... like for v8 or v6 engines that require a header for each side of the V. we have inline engines which require only one.

hotshot header [jscspeed.com]

4 exhaust outlets, 1 header for each exhaust outlet total of 4 so its headers

when were talkin about one exhaust outlet its a header
correct me if im wrong again and sorry for the confusion

[ 04-17-2003, 04:54 PM: Message edited by: Street Prototype ]

i don't know... whatever